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I recommend everyone to use bwrap if you're on linux and alias all package managers / anything that has post build logic with it.

I have bwrap configured to override: npm, pip, cargo, mvn, gradle, everything you can think of and I only give it the access it needs, strip anything that is useless to it anyway, deny dbus, sockets, everything. SSH is forwarded via socket (ssh-add).

This limits the blast radius to your CWD and package manager caches and often won't even work since the malware usually expects some things to be available which are not in a permissionless sandbox.

You can think of it as running a docker container, but without the requirement of having to have an image. It is the same thing flatpak is based on.

As for server deployments, container hardening is your friend. Most supply chain attacks target build scripts so as long as you treat your CI/CD as an untrusted environment you should be good - there's quite a few resources on this so won't go into detail.

Bonus points: use the same sandbox for AI.

Stay safe out there.


This only works for post-install script attacks. When the package is compromised, just running require somewhere in your code will be enough, and that runs with node/java/python and no bwrap.

node is also sandboxed within bwrap I have sandbox -p node if I have to give node access to other folders, I also have sandbox -m to define custom mountpoints if necessary and UNSAFE=1 as a last resort which just runs unsandboxed.

Check also https://github.com/wrr/drop which is a higher-level tool than bwrap. It allows you to make such isolated sandboxes with minimal configuration.

This looks nice but I wouldn't trust a very fresh tool to do security correctly.

As a higher-level alternative to bwrap, I sometimes use `flatpak run --filesystem=$PWD --command=bash org.freedesktop.Platform`. This is kind of an abuse of flatpaks but works just fine to make a sandbox. And unlike bwrap, it has sane defaults (no extra permissions, not even network, though it does allow xdg-desktop-portal).


Shame it's not a bit more mature, it does look like more the sort of thing I want. I use firejail a bit, but it's a bit awkward really.

To be honest - and I can't really believe I'm saying it - what I really want is something more like Android permissions. (Except more granular file permissions, which Android doesn't do at all well.) Like: start with nothing, app is requesting x access, allow it this time; oh alright fine always allow it. Central place to manage it later. Etc.


I think firejail is a much more flexible security sandbox than bwrap. It also comes with pre-defined profiles

bwrap is as secure as you want it to be which I think is the primary advantage over anything else.

I like the idea of bubblewrap, but my pain point is that it is work to set it up correctly with bind mounts and forwarding necessary environment variables to make the program actually work usefully. Could you share your pip bwrap configuration? It sounds useful.

can't really share a file here, feel free to email me

I wrote a Docker-based sandbox [1] for myself last year to control the blast radius of such malicious packages.

https://github.com/ashishb/amazing-sandbox


AFAIK maven doesn’t support post install logic like npm does. You have to explicitly optin with build plugins. It doesn’t let any arbitrary dependency run code on your machine.

some post processors have chains to execution (ex: lombok)

You explicitly opt in by using a compiler plugin. Merely having it as a dependency, like in npm, doesn’t mean it can run code at build time.

> SSH is forwarded via socket

Maybe I misunderstood this point. But the ssh socket also gives access to your private keys, so I see no security gain in that point. Better to have a password protected key.


It's so your private key is not stolen, but you're right passphrase protected keys win anyway. I use hardware keys so this isn't a problem for me to begin with.

Do you have a recommendation for something like bwrap but for macos? I've been trying to use bwrap more on my servers when I remember.

unfortunately not, but there is work being done to support overlays properly I think?

284 on 296gb of ram with deduplication enabled on a 128c with 32Q vgpu.

I swapped to neovim and never looked back. I don't even have vscode, jetbrains or anything similar installed anymore.

AI has made it so so easy to get into neovim and make anything work no matter how obscure it is.

The biggest benefit for me which I haven't realized how good it is with tmux and the low low memory usage. I mean I can keep EVERY project I work on open, quickly switch and maintain.

No more 10gb memory usage on a SINGLE project, no more laggy remote access, no more dreading reboots, no more wasting time.

Kernel panic? everything is right there how you left it, honestly it makes me feel so sad because the poor design of IDE's have been such a show-stopper for a LOT of good project designs that I have completely avoided due to introduced complexities that come not to mention how slow things can become.

Now I can just ssh into my pc from a laptop and work, no synchronization, no need to have a beefy laptop and incredible battery life.


I've been using Vim daily for 13 years and switched to NeoVim about a year of two ago. For me the main advantages over Vim are just the Lua scripting instead of Vimscript, its support for language servers, and better handling of terminals windows running inside Vim.

However, I do still run visual studio in parallel for debugging. It's basically essential when dealing with console game development.


I found DAP neat enough for interactive debugging (when logging is not enough). But I only used DAP under Neovim to debug Python.

I just let AI handle any and all debugging at this point, haven't had an issue where AI couldn't find out what the problem was, finding a solution on the other hand is a hit or miss still.

Can AI pause execution and step through the code line by line? Because that's what I think your parent comment is referring to.

AI can use gdb.

How do you achieve this behavior ? Sorry I haven't done researchs on it because so the answer might be super easy, but I'm curious what's your solution

I haven’t done it specifically but it shouldn’t be much different from other tools calling

yes. better than me actually.

I use neovim daily but am 100% sure I'm not even scratching the surface of its power. In fact I'm not even sure I'm using anything specific to the "neo" variant vs plain vim.

I can do simple search/replace, page up/down, jump to character or delete x words, but I feel like I'm missing a lot to really take advantage of it.

Is there a tutorial or guide people recommend to become more of a power user? The only plugin I have is the Markdown editor for instance.


I'd recommend checking out lazyvim, it comes with a bunch of very sensible plugins and you can read through the lazyvim docs (and then click through to individual plugin docs) to discover them and see which ones you want to use.

I recently switched to LazyVim and the default config in their tutorial included all the “extras”. It transformed vim into some kind of hallucinogenic kaleidoscope of an IDE with all sorts of telescoping overlays and pop-ups with a color scheme that fits well with an 8 year old girl’s princess themed birthday party. I actually screamed a little.

Not sensible. completely insane.


Not sure about the "tutorial", but I use lazyvim as base for LSPs, snacks, neo-tree and a theme matching the rest of my desktop and it seems to be fine?

nvim has a lot of "fun" plugins that you wouldn't actually use so I think you might have ran into that.


there’s the LazyVim distro and the lazy.nvim plugin on which it was built. the latter is a bit more sensible.


Just to add, there are so many hour long Neovim setup videos on youtube that will make your life easier

Honestly, same. I did naturally start to pick up things such as c(code actions) and some git related helpers. But <cnt><c/d/n/o/y/p> gets you 90% of the way there with / navigation.

Also just use the mouse! Lazyvim has great support for it.

<leader>SK is your friend as well.


Remember that `<leader>SK` does not show neovim built ins. Example ctrl-o which moves to older jumplist position is not show in it.

I'd also suggest kickstart.nvim over Lazyvim as its leaner with a primary file for configuration it is not lacking power.


Unfortunately kickstart.nvim is no longer actively maintained.

The repository still get updates, don't see any words to that end on front page. There is a new issue about discussion on what changes for Neovim 0.12 to consider...

Whats your source?


You _can_ just use a mouse, but I would not recommend it for someone who wants to learn to become a power user.

I feel like the habit I’ve benefited the most from on my neovim journey has been reaching for :h before doing any web search. Good completion in the command-line helps a lot there.


> Also just use the mouse! Lazyvim has great support for it.

My mileage was quite different: last time I tried, scrolling too fast with the mouse wheel consistently caused a segfault.


Drew Neil‘s books, Practical Vim and Modern Vim are excellent.

If you search up vim games you'll find some fun tutorials.

Ok, this sounds awesome, but do you miss the GUI integrations? like , being able to pop a document open in your editor from the desktop?

It just feels like it's hard to nail down your preferred workflow / setup ... but it's likely worth it if you're using it daily!

Are there any good visual or video demos of using this type of setup? I'm having trouble picturing what makes people really love this type of TUI-only workflow.


As an aside, it would be straightforward to make vim/neovim the editor that opens when you double click a text file on the desktop.

This kind of setup is at its most powerful when you live on the command line though. For instance, you need to modify .py files across multiple projects that mention a certain variable, have a certain word in their name, and were modified within the last month.

That search is a bit easier in bash/zsh than it is in most IDEs and the strength of vim/neovim is the shell integration.


It's not my kind of workflow but you can download a graphical client like Neovide, which I think has options for opening directly from your file browser.

I typically have a terminal-heavy workflow so it's very rare that I'm browsing to files from within my desktop, but if I am using Dolphin to look for a file I have a "Open terminal here" shortcut and then I'll usually just run "nvim doc.md".

Why not give it a try? You'll likely find that there's an adjustment period and you can always switch back to your old editor if you don't like it. The beauty of it is that you can build it into whatever IDE you want instead of having useless features shoved into your IDE whether you use them or not.


I use Emacs and opening a new file is just pressing “C-x C-f” (find-file), typing the path (completion is available), and pressing enter. As for vim, I would spawn a new terminal (WM keybind, new tab, new pane with tmux), cd to the directory and open it with vim.

The nice thing is that I rely only on the keyboard, no need to point with the mouse. It may not be faster, but typing is sequential and there’s no context switching. So muscle memory helps a lot. Just like you don’t think about each character when you write, I don’t really think about the shortcuts and commands I use.


It's interesting that vim and emacs have this sort of cultural difference where emacs users tend to have one session always open, and vim users are more likely to directly launch a new session per file. I've largely adopted the emacs approach with my usage of neovim, though still use a mix. I have a Session.vim file that opens my windows/tabs/buffers I saved, including remote files using the scp://hostname/filepath syntax. Certain files I edit often enough that I just want them always open, and arranged a particular way. I do sometimes open a one-off separate session to quickly edit a config, though. I don't wanna mess up my muscle memory by introducing too many extra buffers or possibly messing up the order (although if I did do that I could just quit out and reopen the Session.vim file to get back to my saved arrangement).

Another thing I picked up from my time with emacs was making keybinds to interact with the "other" window. One macro I use often will delete the second line of the file in my current window, save, change to the other window, delete second line, save, change back to original window. When activated from keybind it all happens approximately instantly. I also have some binds to jump to the top of the other window's file (without leaving my cursor stuck over there) and so on, letting me keep my cursor in the main area most of the time.


Vim current directory is tied to the process, while each buffer in Emacs have its own default directory.

Also the buffer’s local variable in vim comes from different sources. In emacs, a lot of stuff are tied to a major or minor mode. You only have to toggle them to switch between keybinds, syntax,…


> like , being able to pop a document open in your editor from the desktop?

There's a hackish way to do it by watching for Neovim command line commands that start with "/Users/" (change it if you are on other OS).

Your coding agent can probably hack something up based on:

`//Hackish supports drag and drop files into Neovim by examining when command line starts with "/Users/".`


You're holding it wrong if you're dragging files around a desktop to open them.

Just use a fuzzy file finder within the terminal or within vim itself.


In Neovim, most non-toy language servers allow you to open the doc/definition in a popup/floating window, typically bound to `K`. Some language servers like rust-analyzer and gopls also support opening the docs in your browser.

lazyvim DOES have mouse and GUI-type support. This is a huge myth! I use mouse regulary in neovim and tmux.

What do you use for managing several different projects in nvim?

Sounds awesome. Can you tell us more... How do you ideally use/setup AI,tmux and nvim?

tmux+lazyvim with mouse enabled, tmux with continiuum/resurrect, rest I can't really tell you about other than telling AI exactly what I wanted and doing so until I felt productive again.

My setup looks something like this:

  |ai |nvim           |git view |
  |___|               |________ |
  |ai |               |terminal |
  |   |(proj selector)|         |
ai is an independent tmux window where I can shuffle between project groups.

for AI I found oh-my-pi from can1357 it's magical how good it is. It was a top rated post on HN awhile back.


Awesome! I'll give it a shot. Thank you!

What plugins do you use for AI in neovim?

Not OP, but I don't have use AI within neovim itself, but you can use AI tools to learn and configure neovim to fit your needs.

How many weird terminal bugs do you have in your setup? Eg one that annoys me the most is that pressing esc in insert mode often takes a few seconds to do its thing.

any chance you have a key sequence mapping that starts with esc? sounds like its waiting to see if you are gonna be pressing another key before timing out and do its thing

It happens randomly, which makes me think it's a bug.

Unlikely. Start with empty configuration, and try to reproduce first.

It’s not a bug. The wait times is because the terminal supports escapes codes (which start with an escape character). So most TUI (which put the terminal into a special mode) have a wait time to distinguish between the two (because for the terminal there’s no difference between keyboard events and the software UI). I think it’s configurable in both tmux and vim.

Never had that.

vi/vim has enabled that for 30+ years.

Use windows and leave kernel panics behind :)

i can tell you dont actually SSH often by tbe way. Also, tmux doesnt magically reduce resource requirements of your applications


What are you talking about, kernel panics are part of life with consumer hardware. They would happen even if it was windows?

You're right. I don't use SSH that often due to kubernetes, infact I only use ssh for connecting to my desktop to access my tmux sessions and it's great. I know where you're trying to go with this and it's simply not true.

Who said anything about tmux? We're talking about neovim which is extremely light weight and the LSP's don't sit around being active all the time. They have a set duration where they terminate when unused which is simply not possible in most IDE's (LSP based ones are OK, but have problems reconnecting).


> kernel panics are part of life with consumer hardware.

This isn't right. It was certainly true in the nineties, but I haven't seen one in years on Windows and I spend many hours a day in it both for work and play.


DDR5 where yields are pushed with module level ECC? Janky amd gpu drivers, "RGB" controller drivers misbehaving, some hardware that is just as bad as it was in the 90's since they all use driver sourcecode copied from the 90s.

you mentioned tmux. are you gaslighting me? lmao.

and kernel panics are exceedingly rare on windows. i havent BSOD'd in eons


Kernel panics are almost entirely about bad RAM on all systems today. But last time I was stuck on Windows, about 2017ish, I was suffering constantly from blue screens in a way that never triggered on linux.

yes I mentioned tmux as a project management/switcher tool what about it? (how good (nvim) is with tmux and the low low memory usage.

I haven't had a kernel panic once on reliable hardware. Linux is way more stable than windows device drivers and progressively less reliable graphics drivers.


Cloudflare has the same issue with their new horrible dashboard, 2.1 GB across ONE tab.

trying to load with linux ext4 hmm doesn't load, but it works with my version!

Must be a bug in the linux kernel, let me git clone and build an out-of-tree module...


I was reading that this is actually for neutering cats and that there is some deep dark secret behind these, might be something else tho.

Yes, part of the use of this network is to track strays and neuter them. I don't think it's sinister though.

All fun and games until the cat ends up sitting in front of your monitor, just like my cat is doing right now because it is warm.

Had to move my browser up to see what I am typing.


You need a stand such when the cat's weight is detected in front of the monitor, the monitor is lifted up.

Then the source of heat will disappear and the cat will simply move to the 2nd monitor.

Linus Torvalds runs ARC :)

huh? shipping 10t of metal via ocean to europe is ~3k if you want it fast, less if it's batched with other deliveries. (I would know. I've purchased some)

>> low-mid-complexity stuff

> metal

One of these things is a manufacturing input (metal), where as the other (stuff) is a manufacturing output.

Steel mills are on a different scale altogether. And anyway, the wholesale price of steel to manufacturing industry is around the $2.50 / kg mark for plate and hot rolled sections, but you have to be buying it by the hundreds or tonnes up qualifying for those prices.


either the OP is a poorly worded statement or I lost the plot, we're talking about shipping cost here? the price of lithium is a very big factor for battery pricing?

lots of exciting battery developments in general, especially if donut labs by some miracle is not a fraud.

it was a bit worrying as there was somewhat of a stagnation in battery chemistry, but having non toxic/dangerous battery storage is going to make off-griding so much more attractive.

technically speaking, if every household had solar panels and batteries it would not only be cheaper than the grid it would also have complete independence from oil fluctuations, weather disasters and centralization.

now if you combine that with electric cars that charge off your off-grid system and transition to eletric appliances instead of something like gas the benefits keep stacking all while being pretty much net neutral post manufacturing.


I have had a set of panels on my roof for years, but I think going off grid is overrated unless it becomes drastically cheaper than being on grid.

Grid level batteries are going to be a more efficient way of using the same materials to achieve a particular level of supply. It's just at the moment there's a "competency arbitrage" where infrastructure is way slower than building it yourself.


I can attest that. I installed panels on my house, they are not enough to cover my electrocity needs, let alone gas (heating). Even if it would be enough to cover electricity needs, the cost was (upfront) more than the equivalent of the next 20 years in bills.

To be fair, many of the costs are because of high demand (artificial, because the gov. mandates it to be installed) and lots of work to be integrated in the national grid. But as things are right now, it not economically convenient (at least where I live) and for what I have heard, in other places is not much different.


This is the one thing where a HOA or a similar Co-op might be useful.

Everyone has panels on their roofs and they own a shared grid-scale battery that they feed into.


As an owner of household solar panels, there are weeks, sometimes even months with very little solar products, especially during the colder months.

While I don't regret getting them, they are absolutely not good enough to be the only solution.


I think if energy storage is cheap enough and solar panel pricing continues to go down (especially with this new tech) a time where you can have 10 days of reserve and 50%+ overproduction is not that far away IMO. Small 2-3 floor apartments especially can benefit from a mini local grid, each roof + shared land is a lot of sun real-estate.

It doesn't have to be perfect a generator with ~7 days of fuel can go a really long way for any kind of low solar activity event. 7 days of fuel is roughly half the size of the generator.

At the end of the day it's math, figure exactly what is needed, if it works out then great, if not, continue waiting.


yeah solar is largely geographic dependent

however in the southern hemisphere - solar is a win .


Southern hemisphere receives roughly the same amount of sunlight as northern.

Solar is a win everywhere with a sunny weather.


But land is not distributed equally in the two hemispheres. In the southern hemisphere it's generally concentrated near the equator, where it gets more sunlight.

People just don’t realise how energy intensive a manufacturing economy is.

Which is fine if your fantasy includes offshoring all of that and shipping the finished products in to the local market.

Which, no matter how you slice it, has to be more energy intensive than manufacturing locally.


The globe looks radically different when presented in transport-energy-cost-distance.

Bulk container ships are crazy efficient. It makes more energy sense for a nation like France to trade with the eastern US than it does with Hungary.


They’re crazy efficient because they use bunker fuel and have zero legal requirements because they all flag up as a country with no laws.

nothing stops them from also using swarms of solar panels on their roofs to at minimum offset the energy needs, localized power plants to save on transmission costs, raw high voltage power.

Hetzner does this!


I’d like to add construction materials to the list of energy intensive products. Glass, bricks, rockwool and cement.

if every household had solar panels and batteries

High density housing is unlikely to be compatible with that.

Also rental dwelling owners and people with limited economic resources tend to be less likely to make those kinds of capital investment.


> High density housing is unlikely to be compatible with that.

To the level of total energy independence? Indeed. But even an apartment can get some PV.

There's even PV specifically designed for renters in apartments.

> Also rental dwelling owners and people with limited economic resources tend to be less likely to make those kinds of capital investment.

Not so: https://www.lidl.de/p/tronic-balkonkraftwerk-860-wp-800-w-to...

As per my first line, 800 W is not going to be total energy independence.

But it's €249, cheaper than all but the cheapest phones.

In the best case, it can pay for itself in the first year; though obviously a north-facing apartment gets almost nothing from it.


They are not forced to make those kinds of capital investments if they're unable - they'd be no worse off than today. Those who do get cheaper electricity (in lieu of whatever they could've otherwise spent that capital on).

However, it's the onus of the gov't (regional or federal) to create the investment needed for large, industrial scale solar and battery storage. That's what taxpayer money should be spent on.


> they'd be no worse off than today.

They will, assuming the people that went off grid stop paying for it. As fewer people pay for it the costs per capita grow


The cost of the grid has already been paid for. Upgrades to the grid has a higher per-capita cost, if there's fewer people paying for those upgrades today.

But they're not worse off, because the upgrades are better. For them to be worse off, the upgrades they pay for has to be worse than what they got today.


> The cost of the grid has already been paid for.

You should really talk to some California utilities and their wildfire exposure.

And anywhere else, anything you put up you need to maintain. And aren't most grids built with loans anyway? That interest would be born by fewer people.

Not sure if you own a house, if you do, here's a thought experiment.

It's all paid for, right? Doesn't cost a thing to own a home?


Maintenance costs money as well.

yah, this is more for low density/mid density housing, I am sure the roots of 2-3 floor apts should be more than enough to sustain it as energy needs of apartments are lower to begin with. They can also bleed them into parking lots and have cover from the sun.

Even at 2-3 stories, I'm skeptical that there's enough roof surface area to provide enough solar panels to individually cover the electrical use of all the inhabitants. Many 2-3 story apartment buildings don't have parking lots at all - and it's a common pro-density urbanist political project to remove the requirements to build one, because it discourages car use and also makes projects cheaper - but even if they did, a small apartment also means less surface area for solar panels over the parking lot. And once you're in a building with multiple households, that means that the solar panels - and the amount of energy every individual household draws from them - has to be managed communally. I'm glad I don't have to justify the power use of my home server to a group of my neighbors concerned about managing a common resource, and just pay my power bill to the de-facto-monopoly state-regulated electric utility company.

You would be surprised how little power european households consume, but we do have central/gas heating so the math doesn't always work out perfectly. 100-200W for lights/tv/fridge, oven/induction/kettle for 2h ~2000W a day. That's something the solar panels can most definitely handle, of course this is on case by case basis. I consume 300W at idle as I have a home server :)

Apartments have walls too, but we're getting into a territory where it might start becoming ugly.


If you care about getting the population to switch en masse from gas heating to electric-powered heat pump heating - which is an explicit social/political goal of a number of people I know, and one that I'm simultaneously sympathetic to and have serious qualms about - then everyone's gas consumption needs to go down and everyone's electricity consumption needs to go up. Also once you have a heat pump, you have an air conditioner - it's the same technology - and that means that people will want to use it to cool their dwellings in the hot months of the year, even if they weren't previously able to do this with just a gas-powered furnace, resulting in even more electricity consumption.

Honestly, I think it's fine to just keep the electric grid as it is, and not attempt to power every building only from the amount of solar electricity that it can generate from its roof area. The electric grid lets us take advantage of economies of scale, build gigantic solar arrays or nuclear power plants on cheap land outside of town, and crucially leave the management of that grid up to one well-known organization rather than a consortium of several households in an apartment.


Well yah of course, the grid is useful. But new developments should just include solar and storage and simply become the grid I think that's a no-brainer, off-grid or micro-grid would obviously better, but I'd settle for a mix.

Can put panels on walls too.

If the local climate can support going off-grid then batteries makes absolute sense.

The problem starts when you need the grid for some amount of the year or in periods over several years. As consumer we would like to pay 10% of an annual electrical bill if we can produce the remaining 90% ourself. The grid however want to have be paid for investments in power plants and transmission, and to them, costs associated with consumption is only one part of the bill. If the customer consume less energy, and the costs in infrastructure is the same or greater, then they will continue charge the consumer for the full year. In that scenario, you may only consume 10% but your bill will remain at close to 100%. As a consumer one could decide to go without those 10%, but that in itself can be dangerous or expensive, in which case paying 100% may still be rational.


Interesting that the script has flipped, now china is leading breakthroughs and hardware startup culture is perpetuating frauds

>technically speaking, if every household had solar panels and batteries it would not only be cheaper than the grid

Absolutely not, economies of scale. To say nothing of the cost incurred when an issue appears with your installation (lightning strike, water damage, etc) would be much higher.


The problem is that the grid doesn’t really get economies of scale.

Just the grid is often up to 50% of people’s electricity bills, cutting that out is a massive saving.

I think we might see a future where the grid becomes smaller. Still utility scale but skip the continental transmissions and instead run a local city scale grid with renewables, storage and a chemical based carbon neutral backup.


"it would also have complete independence from oil fluctuations..." Indeed. A foreign country can't turn the sun off. And yet Trump.

(Pardon me if you live in another country. I'm starting to wish I did.)


Technically, you can turn off the sun with a nuclear winter. But in that case your main problem would be starvation anyway.

It's batshit crazy that the most powerful and influential person in the world dismisses the above (practical, clinical and irrefutable) as "a green scam" and people go along with it. We do so at our peril on so many levels.

"weather disasters "

Solar does seem to be influenced by those, though. So before battery storage is really, really cheap and plenty, for off grid situations I do would prefer backup gas as well.

(can also be produced locally: https://www.homebiogas.com/shop/backyard-systems/homebiogas-...)


Having some natural gas purely as a secondary emergency heat source is well worth it IMO.

It might not be needed though if you have a battery generator and enough solar panels.

But if you have a BBQ with propane and the sun didn't shine for many many days that should be sufficient.


Your comment is ambiguous; in the event that anybody is interpreting this as "use your propane BBQ to heat your house" don't do that. You are highly likely to get a first-hand experience of CO toxicity.

having a military grade generator (can pick up decomissioned ones for pretty cheap) as a backup still works.

I was thinking just high heat output gas logs. Heat source, you can cook on them and it's not loud.

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